Re: Level of Detail?

[Bill Garmer <bgarmer@tsc.net>]

At 03:29 PM 4/14/97 EST, you wrote:
>On Mon 14-Apr-1997  9:50a, bgarmer@tsc.net wrote:
>
><snip>
>
>BG> I have several problems with using satellites that are parked in orbit.
>BG> The first is that, without ground control (or in the case of the
>BG> satellites
>BG> I work with - with GPS which in turn requires ground control) satellites
>BG> will tend to move towards the gravity anomoly zones (the biggest being
>BG> over
>BG> the South Altantic).  
>
>So would say a team in PR be able to paint a "hybernation" sat in this gravity
>anomoly zones?

The problem wouldn't be putting in a team in position to "paint" satellites in this area - its the fact that it has become the satellite grave yard.  You have several in it right now (when a geo-sat ends it useful life, they basically shut it off and let it drift over there to open up the spot - it is going to hit something, they will give it a little push to move it out of harms way).  Your sleep sat will have to either be strong enough to survive or be smart enough to survive.

>This means all those nice geo-sync and geo-sta sats
>BG> will be out of view of most of the CONUS in short order after the war.
>BG> Second, these satellites don't carry a lot of fuel for moving orbits -
>BG> not
>BG> enough for 150 years.  
>
>
>Let's play with the MP tech for a bit. Say the sat went into deep sleep mode
>and wandered where ever the mag anom zones are.  Let's also say it had a long
>duration fusion plant as well.  With the "crapload" of extra power (vs. say
>photoelectric cells), wouldn't ion (or plasma) onboard engines be enough to
>transfer it to the parking slot and maintain this for a long time?  Now, if we
>have crapload of power, how about a magnetic funnel to guide spaceborne
>hydrogen into a storage system for extra sat propellant?

You are asking for a lot.  The Micro-Sat series bus uses magnetic thrusters that work against the earth's field.  The ion engines still require a propellent of some kind and the "magnetic funnel" would be huge.

>I solve some of this by assuming the Prime Base or
>BG> the alternate C&C will attempt to take control of several sats after the
>BG> war.  This isn't a perfect solution but workable for the short haul -
>BG> that
>BG> is why the project had a lauch facility somewhere.  One problem would be
>BG> that while you are keep your satellites in position, all the other
>BG> satellites are moving out of there orbits and could collide with you.  A
>BG> second is random failures - you would have to have several under control.
>
>Then you are going to hope for Big Sky Theory _or_ have it autonimusly (sp)
>enough to "move" itself out of harms way via RADAR/Laser tracking. 

That is why I would believe they would grab several satellite and hope for the best.  They would be tracking by measuring the downlink (the control station would be surveyed in) so that would prevent needing to build large RADAR.

>BG> Over 150 years, these satellites would break down and die (run out of
>BG> fuel,
>BG> component failures, collisions, etc).  BTW - my lauch facility is for LEO
>BG> sats - easier to launch and control plus is adds a worldwide
>BG> communication capability.
>
>THen unless you have a fair amount of LEO sats for continuous coverage and the
>complexity of constant moving down/uplink antennas.  I still say the cheapo
>way of doing this is to do a moon bounce.  Yes, it's limited coverage time,
>but it's a cheap and skeezy way of cover CONUS. 

Depending on allowable access number (lets say earth-moon-earth bounce is about 50%) you could do it for 16 to 24 satellites for about 100% access.  We handle the constantly changing downlink/uplink problem using smarts in the terminal but you could reverse that and make the satellite repeater much smarter and inter-link the satellites.  Although special build equipment would work better.  Loosing one or satellites will not wreck the system - just put some holes in the coverage.  Even the PRC-68 has enough power to work the system.

EME usually requires a better high gain antenna (the dipole include with teh PRC-70 will not do) than the teams have.  You would have to stop to erect it (I have never bounced signals this way - just reviewing the literature).

Bill


>: damocles@nostromo.gate.net :   Bruce Morrow,a man before and after his time:
>:"The Constitution shall never be construed to prevent the people of the     :
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>
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William R. Garmer
Member Technical Staff
Torrey Science Corporation
3550 General Atomics Ct, Bldg 14
San Diego, CA  92121

Voice: 619/552-1052
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e-mail: bgarmer@tsc.net